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>> Bill Howell, counter-argument : |
11Nov2020 The Covid-19 virus has been isolated many times
By Rachael Krishna
It’s also incorrect to say that the virus that causes Covid-19 would need to meet Koch’s postulates, primarily because Koch’s postulates weren’t written for viruses.
Koch’s postulates were a set of rules outlined by scientist Robert Koch in 1890 to decide whether a bacteria causes a disease. The original four criteria are:
"1. The microorganism must be found in the diseased animal, and not found in healthy animals.
"2. The microorganism must be extracted and isolated from the diseased animal and subsequently grown in culture.
"3. The microorganism must cause disease when introduced to a healthy experimental animal.
"4. The microorganism must be extracted from the diseased experimental animal and demonstrated to be the same microorganism that was originally isolated from the first diseased animal."
As noted by many, these criteria were written before the discovery of viruses, so fail to include them in their consideration of what a disease is.
Dr Griffin outlined other shortcomings in Koch’s rules.
"The first postulate in particular is void as even at Koch’s time (which he later admitted)" he told us. "Folks knew that you could catch e.g. Cholera without necessarily becoming unwell - asymptomatic infection is a massive issue for these ideas (first and third postulates), as is the arrival of molecular biology!"
Another of Koch’s postulates was that bacteria must be able to be isolated from the host. Viruses, unlike bacteria, require host cells in which to replicate, so also cannot be isolated in the same way Koch defined with bacteria, which according to Dr Griffin, required "culture as in a flask of media, so viruses don’t fit this idea."
So simply put, Koch’s postulates are not a good measure of what causes disease in 2020.
2003 Koch's postulates fulfilled for SARS virus
Nature. 2003; 423(6937): 240
Abstract : Severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS) has recently emerged as a new human disease, resulting globally in 435 deaths from 6,234 probable cases (as of 3 May 2003). Here we provide proof from experimental infection of cynomolgus macaques (Macaca fascicularis) that the newly discovered SARS-associated coronavirus (SCV) is the aetiological agent of this disease. Our understanding of the aetiology of SARS will expedite the development of diagnostic tests, antiviral therapies and vaccines, and may allow a more concise case definition for this emerging disease.
Main : According to Koch's postulates, as modified by Rivers for viral diseases, six criteria are required to establish a virus as the cause of a disease1. The first three criteria — isolation of virus from diseased hosts, cultivation in host cells, and proof of filterability — have been met for SCV by several groups2,3,4,5. Moreover, of 96 individuals complying with the World Health Organization's definition of SARS6 in Hong Kong, 86 (90%) yielded laboratory evidence of SCV infection.
We have tested for the three remaining criteria: production of comparable disease in the original host species or a related one, re-isolation of the virus, and detection of a specific immune response to the virus. We inoculated two macaques with Vero-cell-cultured SCV isolated from a fatal SARS case, and monitored their clinical signs, virus excretion and antibody response. The animals were killed six days post-inoculation (d.p.i.), and we then carried out gross and histopathological examinations of them.
-------- Forwarded Message --------|
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2022 10:35:46 -0700
Subject: Re: Koch test and ID of covid - maybe not an issue?
To: Stephen Howell. Gas storage consultant. SEBIL Consulting Services Ltd. Calgary
From: Bill Howell. Hussar. Alberta. Canada
Thanks, Steve. You've already told me that at least twice, and I did read it (in a Steve Kirsch blog you gave me the link to?), but I had forgotten. Thank goodness that you at least have a memory. Hang on to it.
-------- Forwarded Message --------
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2022 10:13:30 -0700
Subject: Re: Koch test and ID o covid - maybe not an issue?
From: Stephen Howell
there is even a million dollar reward out at least at one time to prove covid via koch test
COVID-19 and Influenza Co-infection: A Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis|
Front Med (Lausanne). 2021; 8: 681469. Published online 2021 Jun 25. doi: 10.3389/fmed.2021.681469
Masoud Dadashi,1,2 Saeedeh Khaleghnejad,3 Parisa Abedi Elkhichi,3,4 Mehdi Goudarzi,3 Hossein Goudarzi,3 Afsoon Taghavi,5 Maryam Vaezjalali,3 and Bahareh Hajikhani3,*
Background and Aim: Co-infection of COVID-19 with other respiratory pathogens which may complicate the diagnosis, treatment, and prognosis of COVID-19 emerge new concern. The overlap of COVID-19 and influenza, as two epidemics at the same time can occur in the cold months of the year. The aim of current study was to evaluate the rate of such co-infection as a systematic review and meta-analysis.
Methods: A systematic literature search was performed on September 28, 2019 for original research articles published in Medline, Web of Science, and Embase databases from December 2019 to September 2020 using relevant keywords. Patients of all ages with simultaneous COVID-19 and influenza were included. Statistical analysis was performed using STATA 14 software.
Results: Eleven prevalence studies with total of 3,070 patients with COVID-19, and 79 patients with concurrent COVID-19 and influenza were selected for final evaluation. The prevalence of influenza infection was 0.8% in patients with confirmed COVID-19. The frequency of influenza virus co-infection among patients with COVID-19 was 4.5% in Asia and 0.4% in the America. Four prevalence studies reported the sex of patients, which were 30 men and 31 women. Prevalence of co-infection with influenza in men and women with COVID-19 was 5.3 and 9.1%, respectively. Eight case reports and 7 case series with a total of 123 patients with COVID-19 were selected, 29 of them (16 men, 13 women) with mean age of 48 years had concurrent infection with influenza viruses A/B. Fever, cough, and shortness of breath were the most common clinical manifestations. Two of 29 patients died (6.9%), and 17 out of 29 patients recovered (58.6%). Oseltamivir and hydroxychloroquine were the most widely used drugs used for 41.4, and 31% of patients, respectively.
Conclusion: Although a low proportion of COVID-19 patients have influenza co-infection, however, the importance of such co-infection, especially in high-risk individuals and the elderly, cannot be ignored. We were unable to report the exact rate of simultaneous influenza in COVID-19 patients worldwide due to a lack of data from several countries. Obviously, more studies are needed to evaluate the exact effect of the COVID-19 and influenza co-infection in clinical outcomes.
>> Howell : Note that this is a literature survey only based onlyn studies published by Sep2020, which in turn relied on older data. At first glance, this is NOT based on large-scale proper [DNA, Koch] tests, and the authors do mention the difficulty of diagnostic identification
|Northern Europe||Southern Europe|
|North Africa||Pacific Asia|
|South Asia||Latin America|
|Mesopotamia etc||Russia etc|
|YYG (11May2020 projections)||Uof Washinton - IHME (10May2020 projections)|